From harald@alvestrand.no Tue May 11 14:16:58 2004
Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 00:41:51 -0800
From: Harald Tveit Alvestrand <harald@alvestrand.no>
To: Dean Anderson <dean@av8.com>
Subject: Re: Complaint with regard to Joe Abley conduct on IETF list

--On 11. mars 2004 03:21 -0500 Dean Anderson <dean@av8.com> wrote:

> I'm sorry, you missed the defamatory part. It is essentially identical to
> the first complaint. It is reported in this message:
> http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf/Current/msg24594.html
>
> Joe (as was Paul) is using a trick email address that responds with
> defamatory statements to all Av8 customers who reply to his IETF messages,
> telling them falsely that Av8 netblocks are hijacked. This is defamatory,
> and meant as harrassment. As Joe's message
> http://www1.ietf.org/mail-archive/ietf/Current/msg24596.html indicates, it
> isn't the case that he thinks that Av8's netblocks are actually hijacked,
> or that these netblock are sending spam. He indicates that he is willing
> to talk to Av8 users after harrassing them and defaming Av8. This conduct
> is in violation of the code of conduct.

As I have said about the Vixie complaint - this activity is going on
outside the IETF list.
You were the one who chose to bring this matter to an IETF list, not Joe
Abley.

> Second, as I recall, the response last time (although it took some effort
> to get a serious review, and a second complaint about Randy Bush's failure
> to respond appropriately to the first complaint) was to remove Randy Bush
> as AD.

I am sorry, but if you think your complaints had one iota of effect on
Randy Bush's decision to leave the IESG, I think you are dreaming.
Randy Bush has never been a handler of complaints about behaviour on the
IETF list, so if you were complaining to him, you got the wrong number.

> As was pointed out previously, such behavior was inappropriate and
> in violation of the code of conduct, and it was inappropriate for the IETF
> to ignore complaints about it.
>
> Last, as indicated by your messages, you assumed that this behavior (by
> Paul Vixie at the time) was intentional, and not a mistake or system
> error. So we expect the jabley@isc.org email address will be prevented
> from appearing on the IETF list until it no longer defames Av8 Internet,
> Inc and to that Joe Abley is chastised for violating the code of conduct.

Not at all. You didn't get any decision that your complaint was valid the
last time, and I do not see what's different this time.

Harald